Postone on labor under capitalism

Here is an extremely interesting quote from Postone’s talk, The Current Crisis and the Anachronism of Value:

“[Labor] itself constitutes a new form of interdependence, where people do not consume what they produce, but where, nevertheless, their own labor … function as a quasi-objective means of obtaining the products of others. In serving as such a means, labor and it s products in effect preempt that function on the part of manifest social relations; they mediate a new form of social interrelatedness.”

As with the categories, value and commodity, according to Postone, labor itself should be seen as historically specific to the capitalist mode of production, not transhistorical. In the capitalist mode of production, what we mean by “commodity” refers solely to the commodity that is historically specific to the mode of production, labor power. What we refer to as “value” is the value of the historically specific commodity, labor power.

It would seem to follow from this that by “labor” we are not referring to material productive activity as it is understood in many different mode of production and societies, but only to a specific form of material productive activity that is found in the capitalist mode of production. Marx calls this historically specific form of material productive activity, social labor.

Social labor should not be confused with individual labor carried on separately. The labor is directly social and thus involves no exchange between individual producers. Social labor, unlike labor in simple commodity production, is not mediated through exchange. It is a self-mediating activity:

“At the heart of [Marx’s] analysis is the idea that labor in capitalism has a unique socially mediating function that is not intrinsic to laboring activity transhistorically.”

If social labor has a socially mediating function that is unique  to the capitalist mode of production, what is this unique socially mediating function? The answer seems to be that social labor is the means by which labor power produces and reproduces itself. Which is to say that labor within the capitalist mode of production is not concerned with production of use values in general, but is concerned solely with the production of the historically specific use value, labor power.

The sole function of social labor in the capitalist mode of production is the production of labor power. The sole use value of labor power is social labor, i.e., the production of labor power.

It should follow from this that the category, “socially necessary labor time”, in the capitalist mode of production does not refer to the socially necessary labor time required for, (for instance), production of shoes, houses, cars and other ordinary commodities, but is solely concerned with the socially necessary labor time required for the production of labor power, the peculiar, historically specific, capitalist commodity.

In the capitalist mode of production, the term “socially necessary labor time” is that duration of labor, (measured in some unit of time), that is required to produced the total labor power of society. It would seem to be a mistake to think that the socially necessary labor times of individual ordinary commodities is expressed in their individual prices of production.

This is not to say that these individual socially necessary labor times do not exist; rather, it only means that the SNLTs of ordinary commodities are not expressed in the prices of production of the ordinary commodities. What is expressed in their prices of production is the socially necessary labor time of labor power.

This might explain Postone’s observation that,

“Labor in capitalism, then, is both labor as we transhistorically and commonsensically understand it, according to Marx, and a historically specific socially mediating activity.  Hence, what labor produces, its objectifications –  and here I am referring to the commodity and to capital –  are both concrete labor products and objectified forms of social mediation.”

As labor is understood transhistorically, it produces the value and use value of the ordinary commodity. As labor is understood within the specific historical conditions of capital, however, it produces not the value and use value of the ordinary commodity, but the value and use value of labor power itself.

Another way to say this is that:

  1. the values of ordinary commodities play no role whatsoever in the regulation of the mode of production, and
  2. the prices of individual ordinary commodities tell us nothing about their individual values.

This is important because if you are looking for the law of value to explain the prices of ordinary commodities, you naturally begin with the values of the ordinary commodities themselves. Postone says this is wrong. The values of ordinary commodities play no role whatsoever in the market prices.

To be blunt, the charge that value is redundant when it comes to explaining the prices of individual ordinary commodities is both correct and beside the point, if Postone is correct. Value doesn’t explain the prices of ordinary commodities, it explains the price (wages) of the labor power that goes into their production. With conversion of the value of labor power into money-prices (wages), the first step of the conversion of values into prices is concluded.

The second step now begins.

10 thoughts on “Postone on labor under capitalism”

  1. > “Value doesn’t explain the prices of ordinary commodities, it explains the price (wages) of the labor power that goes into their production.”

    Values are influential over how commodity prices change over time, though, right? Assuming that competition does drive a tendency to equalize the rate of profit, and assuming a commodity money, then there should be a tendency for the price to move towards deviating from the value of the commodity by an amount determined by the average organic composition for production of that commodity, relative to the average organic composition in general. (At least that’s what I’m getting from v3 ch9.)

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    1. I think a simpler way to put this is that value is indeed influential in how commodity prices change over time, but this value is the value of the labor power employed in production, not the individual values of the commodities themselves. This would also imply equalization of the rate of profit.

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      1. I think we both said it wrong here but I’ll try to take that up in a later thread. For now:

        In a given period, the value of commodities is an empirical fact that can be exactly known because it is the average price of each type of commodity.

        The value of commodities is not in any way determined by the labor that went in to them — labor has not one iota of influence over the price of commodities.

        On the contrary, the value of a commodity is the *retrospective* assessment of the value created or destroyed by the labor power that produced a commodity, and the *retrospective* assessment of how the surplus or deficit portion of that value is distributed.

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  2. the value is “the value of the labor power employed in production”

    And the value of labor power is both objective and subjective.

    The base physical limit is objective and the moral/historical is subjective.

    The original question was how and by who the moral/historical would develop? After 1844 Marx chose his subject, the proletariat as that subjective moral/historical force, assuming a progressive and progressing working class which would be compelled to act under this subjectivity.

    Like Plato’s first prisoner in the cave, the proletariat would be “forced” to turn his head and see the truth of his circumstance and see the irrationality of it all, come back to the cave and via collective subjectification/action change that situation.

    Marx: “It is not a question of what this or that proletarian, or even the whole proletariat, at the moment regards its aim. It is a question of what the proletariat is, and what, in accordance with this being, it will historically be compelled to do”

    The compulsion is a motivating force, however does not automatically lead to Marx’s outcome. The counter-forces, the Capitalist class and the State under Capitalist control, also affect the outcome in both reactive and obscurantist ways, and Marx knew that this would affect the freedom of all:

    Marx: “Freedom consists in converting the state from an organ superimposed on society into one completely subordinated to it, and even today forms of state are more free or less free to the extent that they restrict the freedom of the state.”

    And the freedom to associate among the capitalists, and repressive tools of the capitalists (police, legal system, military), are retained and enhanced by the State, where the State restricts other forms of combination, because:

    Marx: “combination always has a double aim, that of stopping competition among the workers, so that they can carry on general competition with the capitalist…the maintenance of the association becomes more necessary to them than that of wages…In this struggle – a veritable civil war – all the elements necessary for a coming battle unite and develop.”

    To Marx this struggle was a war:

    Marx: “It is only in an order of things in which there are no more classes and class antagonisms that social evolutions will cease to be political revolutions.”

    as he quoted:

    Marx: “Combat or Death: bloody struggle or extinction. It is thus that the question is inexorably put.”

    Marx calls for active equality, active struggle for freedom from both the Capitalists and the State. This is social evolution.

    But he also says:

    Marx: “For the oppressed class to be able to emancipate itself, it is necessary that the productive powers already acquired and the existing social relations should no longer be capable of existing side by side”

    What would cause these no longer to exist side by side?

    Marx: “Of all the instruments of production, the greatest productive power is the revolutionary class itself.”

    How and where does this apply in 2017/18?
    With rampant unequal development and unequal exchange and seemingly omnipotent States guaranteeing that exchange.

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    1. And the value of labor power is both objective and subjective. The base physical limit is objective and the moral/historical is subjective.

      Help me here. Marx was clear that a certain historical and moral element enters into the determination of the value of labor power. However, I see no place in the text (Capital, volume 1) where he asserts this historical and moral element is subjective. Can you specify your citation?

      I’m not saying you are wrong, but I hesitate to adopt your phrasing unless you can show this.

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    2. > “Marx: “Combat or Death: bloody struggle or extinction. It is thus that the question is inexorably put.”

      > “Marx calls for active equality, active struggle for freedom from both the Capitalists and the State.”

      I think that is a misreading.

      Yes, it is true that in that final section of “Poverty of Philosophy” Marx lambastes both bourgeois economists and utopian socialists (Proudhon) for their exhortations against worker combinations.

      Yes, it is also true that defames them by identifying what appears to be their motivations.

      A close examination of the remainder though, shows that Marx was arguing these points:

      1. That the economic predictions of the bourgeois economists, and adopted by Proudhon are empirically and theoretically false.

      2. That where worker combination has had the greatest success, capital has become more dominant relative to the world market. This is because the combination of workers forces advances in the technology of production as capitalists seek to shift to a more capital intensive production to compensate for the victories of the combination.

      Critically in this context:

      3. That worker combinations arise more or less inevitably from “large-scale industry” to the extent that industry spatially concentrates workers and presents them each with the thought that they have a common interest against the capitalist who employs them.

      In other words, Marx is not exhorting worker combinations but explaining why it is predictable and inevitable in certain forms of production processes.

      4. That the development of a society where this process is underway strengthens combinations of workers until the struggle takes on a political character — meaning that class antagonisms internal to capitalism become more overt, even if not more widely understood in their essential character.

      5. That this political struggle — and here “political” is in the broadest sense that includes even violent confrontation — what is always at stake is the terms between classes in a class society. In other words, this fight between the classes *never* ends class society.

      and again critically:

      6. That liberation from class society is not the triumph of one class over another, but “an order of things in which there are no more classes and class antagonisms”

      You quoted that last bit but gave it the opposite of its meaning in context. When Marx concludes “Till then, on the eve of every general reshuffling of society, the last word of social science will always be:

      ““Le combat ou la mort; la lutte sanguinaire ou le neant. C’est ainsi que la quéstion est invinciblement posée.” ”

      He is not exhorting proletarians to a death combat with the capitalists — he is saying that such combat is inherent in and produced by capitalism. This, he says, is just a scientific fact.

      So what brings about an “order of things in which there are no more classes and class antagonisms?” It is *not* the essentially mortal combat between the classes because such combat is simply integral to capitalist class society — at least not in the sense that the proletarians must “win” that combat.

      Rather, it is the development of capitalist society to the point where people are united in the *recognition* that perpetuation of the capital v. worker combat — and the social order that produces it — is intolerable.

      Recognition of the anachronistic character of wages (i.e. class society), as contrasted to the triumph of one class over another, is a deep distinction. In particular, this distinction implies that capitalism might end not with proletarian triumph, but with a global moment of recognition that an ecological future which includes humans is not only uncertain, but is in fact clearly no longer compatible with political economy at all. Confronted with that stark recognition, a people unified in that imaginary might — in a way similar to how 19th century English workers valued the combination itself over maximal wages — choose to begin simply disregarding the key imperatives of capital, letting its edifices collapse, letting the chips fall where they may — meanwhile struggling in unity to rapidly improvise and propagate alternatives to the money system, particularly wage labor.

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  3. While waiting for the second shoe to drop and answer this cliff hanger,

    does anyone know of a Leftist Twitter corner that isn’t endless cringe virtue signalling or an alt-right Twitter that is ACTUALLY funny, not just one that thinks it’s funny?

    Kinda bored or anxious waiting between Jehu posts now that he’s every other few days.

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    1. That does it, I’m gossiping. Can’t hold it in.

      All the radical leftists have become Democrat hacks. The bloggers begging for money with no dignity, the loners who bend for no man, the activists with a singular purpose.

      They said Bernie wasn’t a real socialist, too much of a mainstream partisan creep. Now they spend their time blogging against Republicans as if they worked for Democraps.

      The degeneracy of the theoretical and activist soi-disant Left in America is the most contemptible thing ever.

      I won’t name names, but suffice it to say that between those who are grifters finessing their celebrity hungry “alt lifestyle” fans and the saintly purists who never betray their principles to the point of starvation (although they always make rent!),
      there is no daylight.
      What a disgusting spectacle all those pompous, righteous, useless masturbators are.

      Only thing worse is some of them are always crying that they are disabled or about to be evicted or whatnot, so please give money so they can continue producing the kind of “anti imperialist” drivel that we neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee –
      eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed.

      And they all have a morality from the Victorian era. Or Salem witch trials.

      Nothing in life has EVER made me say the following phrase but the American “anti imperialist Left”:
      these people should get a real job. Organize a union. Participate in a charity. All the stuff they tell undocumented migrants to do.

      This is what happens when I can’t get my fix of Jehu saying this on his Twitter, in spurts.

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      1. Berniebro post-mortem on Democrats winning in Alabama:

        “Now we see that Democrats can win on radical far left platforms like DougJones even in Alabama, the time for Democrats to support single payer and voting rights is now! We need to elect more Democrats, our work is just begun….”

        So we can put to rest even the slightest notion that the dissenting Democrats like Bernibots have even the slightest inclination towards anything approaching socialism, let alone communism.

        “Donate my patreon for more Bernie stumping. Free dinner with me for $400 donations. I am disabled and forced to beg you”

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